Curse

AmoebaInfectionTechnique · Jun 24, 2009, 07:52 PM // 19:52

Vibrations travelling through the air goes into your ears which is then interpreted by the brain and thus making a sound.

Divinitys Creature · Jun 24, 2009, 09:31 PM // 21:31

Sound is best described by phonons. Even if the tree never falls the main fact of it's existence will mean it is emitting and absorbing phonons within itself. Therefore the fall is incidental, it is always making a sound.

Roy_ · Jun 24, 2009, 10:48 PM // 22:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Divinitys Creature

Sound is best described by phonons. Even if the tree never falls the main fact of it's existence will mean it is emitting and absorbing phonons within itself. Therefore the fall is incidental, it is always making a sound.

But the fall itself, does a tree fall the same way when when noone is around?
We can never prove that it does or dosen't. It is a PHILOSOPHY question and cannot be answered...

Give your opinion, but please don't believe that its your way or the highway...

EDIT: that was not an attack on the above poster, it was in response to some others...

Hanging Man · Jun 24, 2009, 11:07 PM // 23:07

Of course they make a sound
regardless of the fact you are there to hear the sound, a sound is still made
it is just common knowledge and common sense to think there is a sound made

Arkantos · Jun 25, 2009, 02:58 AM // 02:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hanging Man

Of course they make a sound
regardless of the fact you are there to hear the sound, a sound is still made
it is just common knowledge and common sense to think there is a sound made

If it's all common sense and common knowledge, this wouldn't be a very old, popular philosophical question now, would it?

sph0nz · Jun 25, 2009, 08:35 AM // 08:35

This age old riddle isn't even about whether a falling tree makes a sound in an empty forest. The main point is that people in debates need to define their terms beforehand to prevent confusion. A definition of "sound" needs to be made. Does it need to be perceived to be considered a sound? Or do soundwaves define what a "sound"?

There are many answers to this riddle; it can also inquire into the nature of reality (and depending on your answer, can determine where you stand) as well as the nature of knowledge.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roy Frogger

You don't have too. For all we know you aren't real. The Board that we are posting on isn't real and our feeble fabrication of the world isn't real.

For all we know not one of us is truly existent at all. A philosopher once said "I think, therefor I am", but is that truly so? We think, yes, and we have self awareness. Does that make us real though?

Yes, it does if you're a solipsist. "I think, therefore I exist". I am a thinking thing. The very act of questioning my own existence proves that I exist.

Quote:

Philosophy cannot be debated because none of it can be proven.

On the contrary, philosophy is, will and can be debated because none of it can be empirically proven. Otherwise, it would cease to be philosophy and would be under a different category such as science or mathematics. Yes, there are debates in the scientific community, but they are not about philosophical things.

Cebe · Jun 25, 2009, 08:58 AM // 08:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Etta

Ok Cebe formerly know as Celestial Beaver. Listen here, if I farted and you didn't hear it, did I fart?

Farts are exempt from the rule due to the "Silent but Deadly" clause.

Roy_ · Jun 25, 2009, 02:27 PM // 14:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by sph0nz

This age old riddle isn't even about whether a falling tree makes a sound in an empty forest. The main point is that people in debates need to define their terms beforehand to prevent confusion. A definition of "sound" needs to be made. Does it need to be perceived to be considered a sound? Or do soundwaves define what a "sound"?

There are many answers to this riddle; it can also inquire into the nature of reality (and depending on your answer, can determine where you stand) as well as the nature of knowledge.

Yes, it does if you're a solipsist. "I think, therefore I exist". I am a thinking thing. The very act of questioning my own existence proves that I exist.

On the contrary, philosophy is, will and can be debated because none of it can be empirically proven. Otherwise, it would cease to be philosophy and would be under a different category such as science or mathematics. Yes, there are debates in the scientific community, but they are not about philosophical things.

Let me rephrase my "philosophy cannot be debated" you were right to say I was wrong, what I meant is that it would be very hard to win that debate. -_-

I think therefor I am,

Why does thinking prove I exist? for all we know the fact that we think proves that we DON'T exist, this thought, this wonder of knowing if we exist, I think it proves that we as us don't exist.
The doubt is correct in other words.
I know none will agree with me on that but whatever...

Divinitys Creature · Jun 26, 2009, 12:26 AM // 00:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roy Frogger

But the fall itself, does a tree fall the same way when when noone is around?
We can never prove that it does or dosen't. It is a PHILOSOPHY question and cannot be answered...

Give your opinion, but please don't believe that its your way or the highway...

EDIT: that was not an attack on the above poster, it was in response to some others...

Ok. The question presupposes we know there is a tree that exists therefore it is making a sound. Otherwise it does not exist, at least we cannot confirm that or deny it.

I think the question itself is wrong because it asks for confirmation that something you define to exist actually exists.

Reality could just be a local phenomenon or maybe we live in the hyper real.

Your question is a deep one. I also wonder why perceived consciousness is taken as a standard for defining the nature of (the possibility of a) "reality".

Roy_ · Jun 26, 2009, 01:00 AM // 01:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Divinitys Creature

Ok. The question presupposes we know there is a tree that exists therefore it is making a sound. Otherwise it does not exist, at least we cannot confirm that or deny it.

I think the question itself is wrong because it asks for confirmation that something you define to exist actually exists.

Reality could just be a local phenomenon or maybe we live in the hyper real.

Your question is a deep one. I also wonder why perceived consciousness is taken as a standard for defining the nature of (the possibility of a) "reality".

YES! Reality is what we make of it.

OoO Rift OoO · Jun 26, 2009, 02:03 AM // 02:03

No because no1 is around to hear it. Duuuh, not that much of a debate imo.

Roy_ · Jun 26, 2009, 02:42 AM // 02:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by OoO Rift OoO

No because no1 is around to hear it. Duuuh, not that much of a debate imo.

I give up, screw it, just screw it....

OoO Rift OoO · Jun 26, 2009, 03:03 AM // 03:03

I think we see who wins THIS argument!
>

Sam Arnon · Aug 01, 2009, 01:37 AM // 01:37

" If a tree falls in the forest and no one is around, does it make a sound?"

that isn't the original question.

This was the original question

"When a tree falls in a lonely forest, and no animal is near by to hear it, does it make a sound? Why?"

Omgopolis · Aug 01, 2009, 09:24 AM // 09:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by fenix

The REAL question is this;

If a man stands in the forest with no women around, is he still wrong?

Of course not. He wouldn't be wrong even if he were surrounded by women.

On a more serious note;

If there were no women around, would they still be wrong?

Bobby2 · Aug 01, 2009, 09:34 AM // 09:34

Wherever they are, they're wrong. Fact.

JupiterStarWarrior · Aug 01, 2009, 06:33 PM // 18:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aera

Of course it does. The air will still vibrate and cause sounds.

This. Also, the creaking tree makes noise, too.

Evasion Twenty · Aug 01, 2009, 10:01 PM // 22:01

Why wouldn't it?

Rocky Raccoon · Aug 02, 2009, 05:05 PM // 17:05

If sound is relative to the person hearing it and they are not there, then there is no sound.